12 replies to this topic

[SkiTimby]

I was up at Timberline last week (sorry, no pictures) and was stunned at how minimal the Palmer Snowfield looked. The permanent patch of snow was mostly brown and is smaller than I've ever seen it. The edge of the snow has retreated FAR from the Palmer lift's top terminal and midstation, making skiing/boarding impossible without excessive walking.

I guess this isn't surprising considering how awful the snowpack was last winter, but still it was shocking to see. Timberline closed on August 18th this year... the 2nd earliest close since the original Riblet Palmer double chair was built in the late 1970s. But this is the earliest close ever due to snow conditions, as the previous early-close was due to the Palmer chair's conversion into a high-speed quad during the summer of 1996. Never before has Timberline not made it to Labor Day due to low snow conditions... and this is the first year since the quad went in that there will not be September & October skiing/boarding on the snowfield. Sad.

In other news, the proposed Timberline Express hasn't been approved by the Forest Service yet, so the original plan to build the lift this summer is obviously not going to happen. Hopefully approval will come shortly, so the lift can be built next summer instead. For those unaware, the Timberline Express is proposed to be a high-speed quad that will open new terrain below the existing Pucci and Stormin' Norman lift pods. The lift will begin at elevation 4800' and terminate just above the bottom of the Magic Mile Express... very close to Timberline Lodge. It will serve much of the Stormin' Norman pod and all of the Pucci pod (I bet that lift won't run anymore except during peak times). It's runs will also be lit for night skiing.

[SkiBachelor]

It's weird that the Forest Service won't approve it when it actually owns the resort, but leases out the resort operation.

Detachables are pretty expensive so that could be another reason for the Forest Service not to approve it when it would have to pay for some of it.

P.S. I'm pretty sure the U.S. Forest Service still owns it since I haven't read anything about it in SAM switching owners, but it bought the ski area and lodge when it went into bankruptcy back in 70s.

[Lendog]

Any word on the proposed gondola that is going to go from Collins Lake Resort in Govy up to Timberline?

This post has been edited by Lendog: 06 September 2005 - 11:54 PM

[skier2]

Timberline has bigger issues to worry about than the new lift. And no. they can't install it, because they DON'T have the money. This year, due to a decrease in profits from less summer skiiers, the resort was forced to borrow $2 million from the state to stay open.

[SkiTimby]

The Forest Service doesn't own any ski area, nor does the Forest Service own any land a ski area might sit on... the "public" does. The Forest Service is the government agency established to manage land that is owned by the public and is responsible for deciding how the land is used.

Timberline Lodge and ski area are operated by RLK & Company. That company has a special-use permit from the Forest Service to operate the publicly-owned Lodge and to develop the ski area within the Mount Hood National Forest according to the approved Master Plan. All costs of maintenance and expansion are the ski area operator's responsibility. The Forest Service isn't involved financially.

Here's how a proposed new lift on public land comes into being:

Ski area: "We want to build this new lift... a lift that is included in our approved Master Plan. Our proposal identifies the 'purpose' and 'need' for this new lift... and includes a number of other alternatives to our primary proposal."

Forest Service: "OK... we'll draft an Environmental Impact Statement (EIS) for what you propose and each of the alternatives".

Forest Service (after MANY months): "Here's the draft EIS detailing how each of the proposed alternatives will affect the Forest & the skiers/boarders, and here is our preferred alternative. The public now has an opportunity to read this and comment on it. After we review the public's comments, we'll issue a Record of Decision."

Forest Service (after MANY MORE months): "Here's our Record of Decision."

Specific to Timberline ski area and the proposed Timberline Express, the draft EIS has been released. You can read it online at http://www.fs.fed.us...thood/projects/
The public has been invited to comment... and now the ski area awaits the final Record of Decision... which should come anytime now.

Timberline has a very good working history with the Forest Service. Timberline also isn't nearly as hated as is nearby Mount Hood Meadows by anti-development environmentalists. For those reasons, I believe this lift will get approved and, should Timberline have the money to spend, construction could occur next summer.

[SkiTimby]

skier2, on Sep 7 2005, 01:39 PM, said:

Timberline has bigger issues to worry about than the new lift. And no. they can't install it, because they DON'T have the money. This year, due to a decrease in profits from less summer skiiers, the resort was forced to borrow $2 million from the state to stay open.
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I hadn't heard this. Could you respond with how you found this out and where you found this information? I'd really like to learn more...

[Lift Dinosaur]

SkiTimby,
Is that you? My riggin' compadre from PNSAA?

How is it having a "summer off?"

[SkiTimby]

Lift Dinosaur, on Sep 7 2005, 05:27 PM, said:

SkiTimby,
Is that you? My riggin' compadre from PNSAA?

How is it having a "summer off?"
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sorry, no. I'm actually just a member of the Portland media who learned to ski at Timberline when growing up. Now I take an active interest in the area and occasionally report on the conditions/development up on the mountain.

[skier2]

I skiied out at Hood for about a month this summer, and that's how I heard abot timberline's financial problems. There were lifties and coaches talking about it, and since most of the lifties do other jobs, they know. Plus the people at customer service also said that thy'd been having some problems. They had such a bad winter season that they didn't have any cash to run the lifts in the summer, so they had to borrow money.

[Lendog]

It was a bad winter, which in turn makes it a bad summer.......

[Warren733]

SkiTimby, on Sep 6 2005, 10:34 PM, said:

I was up at Timberline last week (sorry, no pictures) and was stunned at how minimal the Palmer Snowfield looked. The permanent patch of snow was mostly brown and is smaller than I've ever seen it. The edge of the snow has retreated FAR from the Palmer lift's top terminal and midstation, making skiing/boarding impossible without excessive walking.

I guess this isn't surprising considering how awful the snowpack was last winter, but still it was shocking to see. Timberline closed on August 18th this year... the 2nd earliest close since the original Riblet Palmer double chair was built in the late 1970s. But this is the earliest close ever due to snow conditions, as the previous early-close was due to the Palmer chair's conversion into a high-speed quad during the summer of 1996. Never before has Timberline not made it to Labor Day due to low snow conditions... and this is the first year since the quad went in that there will not be September & October skiing/boarding on the snowfield. Sad.

In other news, the proposed Timberline Express hasn't been approved by the Forest Service yet, so the original plan to build the lift this summer is obviously not going to happen. Hopefully approval will come shortly, so the lift can be built next summer instead. For those unaware, the Timberline Express is proposed to be a high-speed quad that will open new terrain below the existing Pucci and Stormin' Norman lift pods. The lift will begin at elevation 4800' and terminate just above the bottom of the Magic Mile Express... very close to Timberline Lodge. It will serve much of the Stormin' Norman pod and all of the Pucci pod (I bet that lift won't run anymore except during peak times). It's runs will also be lit for night skiing.

According to wikipedia.org, the Palmer lift was installed in 1980. link: http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Magic_Mile

[Peter]

I think it was 1978, from the Timberline book and lift installation survey.

[aug]

Skier, on Feb 12 2007, 04:55 PM, said:

I think it was 1978, from the Timberline book and lift installation survey.

rebuilt in1996 by dopp.