153 replies to this topic

[boardski]

Also for 1971, the Heron Poma double chairs are Peachtree and Paradise. Peachtree, of course, being the shorter of the two.

[SkiBachelor]

That is weird unless the lift was installed in the wrong place (it's happened before) and it had to be shorted because it might have terminated on someone elses property.

Thanks, I wasn't sure if that was Peachtree since that lift seems a little bit longer than 1200 ft.

[SkiBachelor]

The 1970 lift installation survey is now up.

http://skilifts.org/install_na1970.htm

[nathanvg]

I can name the keystone lifts in 70 and 71. The lifts in 71 have nearly the same stats, but I think I have them right.

70
Keystone (Montezuma) 2C Riblet N/A 7180 1669 1260 500
Keystone (Argentine) 2C Riblet N/A 4012 904 1200 500
71
Keystone (St. John's) 2C Heron Poma N/A 6520 1590 1256 500
Keystone (Peru) 2C Heron Poma N/A 6826 1582 1256 500

[SkiBachelor]

I wonder why the Riblets were removed so quickly and replaced by two Yans?

[phillybluntz]

WBSKI, on Sep 14 2005, 07:12 PM, said:

1972
Lake Louise is Larch Chair
Salmo is T-bar
Snowpatch is T-bar

"Cranbrook" is most likely Kimberley but no guarantees at the moment. I will try to contact the museam up there.

There is a sign on the hwy to Port Alberni at the road to mt arrowsmith that is carved out of wood and looks fairly old. It has a lift status thing saying if the "Chair" is open. So you could if you like call the 1974 installation at Arrowsmith "Chair" at blewitt it would be just the T-bar

There is a ski hill in Cranbrook, it closed a long time ago due to lack of snow. There were a couple of t-bars there and the towers are still in the ground.
I will try and find more info! The M-Latta is still at Kimberley the carriers have been removed, I think it is up for sale still.

This post has been edited by phillybluntz: 19 September 2005 - 11:06 AM

[boardski]

SkiBachelor, on Sep 19 2005, 12:24 PM, said:

I wonder why the Riblets were removed so quickly and replaced by two Yans?

The Riblet version of the Montezuma acutally was there until the current Doppelmayr HSQ replaced it in 1990, however, the drive terminial was replaced in 1980 by a Yan drive terminal the same year Erickson went in. Everything else was still Riblet, however, until the entire lift was replaced. Regarding Argentine, I would be curious to hear the story behind that lift since it was replaced with the current Yan version in 1977.

[poloxskier]

boardski, on Sep 19 2005, 02:38 PM, said:

The Riblet version of the Montezuma acutally was there until the current Doppelmayr HSQ replaced it in 1990, however, the drive terminial was replaced in 1980 by a Yan drive terminal the same year Erickson went in. Everything else was still Riblet, however, until the entire lift was replaced. Regarding Argentine, I would be curious to hear the story behind that lift since it was replaced with the current Yan version in 1977.

I was fairly sure that the Montezuma was a Heron-Poma when it was replaced with the current Dopp. Or at least modifications were made by H-P. While I was not extremely knowledgeable at that point about lifts It always seemed identical to the Peru. I am not sure that if it was what year it was installed.

[boardski]

poloxskier, on Sep 19 2005, 06:35 PM, said:

I was fairly sure that the Montezuma was a Heron-Poma when it was replaced with the current Dopp. Or at least modifications were made by H-P. While I was not extremely knowledgeable at that point about lifts It always seemed identical to the Peru. I am not sure that if it was what year it was installed.

The Sts John lift was the lift which was identical to Peru, it was installed along with Peru in 1971, while the original Argentine and Montezuma chairs were installed in 1970 by Riblet. I know that the Montezuma had side-bar carriers with footrests but I am not sure about Argentine.

[poloxskier]

Oh ok It must have just been too long. I knew that the St. Johns was identical to Peru but I thought that Montezuma was too. Any idea why the Argentine was replaced so quickly?

Also one of the H-P pomas at Keystone, either the '70 or '72 was at the far west part of the mountain house base allong the trees and was simply called "Poma". I believe that it has now been removed. Back in the day when they advertized beginner skiing at night they used that area.

[nathanvg]

boardski, on Sep 19 2005, 04:38 PM, said:

The Riblet version of the Montezuma acutally was there until the current Doppelmayr HSQ replaced it in 1990, however, the drive terminial was replaced in 1980 by a Yan drive terminal the same year Erickson went in. Everything else was still Riblet, however, until the entire lift was replaced. Regarding Argentine, I would be curious to hear the story behind that lift since it was replaced with the current Yan version in 1977.

Montezuma is listed as a triple when it was upgraded by Yan:
1980
Keystone Montezuma 3C Lift Engineering N/A 7180 1699 1260 500

But just a double when first installed.

1970
Keystone* Montezuma 2C Riblet N/A 7180 1669 1260 500

Boardski, do you think this is wrong? Was any of the 1970 lift kept?

I also wonder why the first two riblets were removed when they were less than 10 years old. The argentine is really odd, because it did not change to a triple.

[boardski]

The Yan FGT mentioned in the 1980 survey was the Erickson lift which was replaced by the Summit Express in 1997. The only part of the original Riblet version of the FGD Montezuma lift which was upgraded by Yan was the drive terminal which occured the same year (1980). The "Poma" lift was one of two parallell platter-tows which used to run to the right (looking up the hill) of the current Checkerboard lift. Montezuma was always a double chair.

[SkiBachelor]

Boardski, are you sure that the Montezuma chair wasn't upgraded to a triple because I have the LE installation sheet(s) and it lists the lift being upgraded to a triple?

[poloxskier]

I never rode it as a triple and I used to ski Keystone alot back then. I do not believe that it was upgraded to a triple since I rode it the year before it was removed and the Dopp HSQ installed and am about 95% sure that it was still a double.

This post has been edited by skiersage: 21 September 2005 - 04:32 AM

[lstone19]

SkiBachelor, on Sep 9 2005, 11:57 PM, said:

The 1975 Lift installation sheet is now up.

http://skilifts.org/install_na1975.htm

What was the Hall double Pico installed in 1975? I'm guessing the Lower Chair (base to the bottom of the Summit Chair along Lower Pike) although I think 1975 is too late (I skiied Pico a lot in the 70's but I think some of that skiing was prior to 1975 and the Lower Chair didn't change during that time). Another site claims the Lower Chair was a 1962 Stadelli but the accompanying picture is not what I remember (truss towers while I remember tubular towers). Still another site claims Pico only had two Halls - both triples which would make them the Knome's Knoll Triple and the Little Pico triple. Lower Chair was definitely a double and while I wasn't into lift manufacturers then, the look I remember definitely could make it a Hall. One thing I definitely remember was the Lower Chair had a top drive terminal with an underground motor room.

[SkiBachelor]

I have no idea, maybe Yaoma can shed some light on the subject?

[Jonni]

Looking through different maps that I have seen and looking at overall lengths of some of these lifts, I'm still not sure what it may be. Most of the trail maps that I have seen have shown that where Upper, Middle and Lower Pike are it started with a double chair that went halfway up then, they the rest of the way to the summit with another double chair, then at some point these two chairs were put together into one chair that went base to summit. The summit poma was added sometime in the mix as well. As far as lengths for these lifts go, the Lower Double (the first one double chair toward the summit that was built) fits the specs as far as length and vert. Though the date that it was installed doesn't fit. The brochures I looked at showed that the lower double was already installed sometime before 1960 and the summit double was proposed. This would put the Lower Double as being installed in the 50s and the Summit Double in the early to mid sixties as the next map later (1969), shows both of them. The Outpost was installed in 69' and was put in right after the map I looked at was printed. Gnomes Knoll was installed as a triple by Hall in 1972. It also couldn't have been the Little Pico Triple because there is a plaque at the base of it that says it replaced the original Pico T-Bar in 1980.

Another thing that throws a monkey wrench into this would be the fact that in 1978 Poma installed a double chair (2500ft long, 800ft vert). I don't know where that could have been, but where ever it was it had a good pitch to it.

Trailmap sources http://teachski.com/brochures/state%20maps...ntbrochures.htm Click on links in upper right.

[lstone19]

Jonni, on Nov 7 2005, 12:01 PM, said:

Looking through different maps that I have seen and looking at overall lengths of some of these lifts, I'm still not sure what it may be. Most of the trail maps that I have seen have shown that where Upper, Middle and Lower Pike are it started with a double chair that went halfway up then, they the rest of the way to the summit with another double chair, then at some point these two chairs were put together into one chair that went base to summit.

No, I don't think they were ever combined into one chair but I can't say that authoratatively (but see below in the addendum). I think 1980 was the last time I was there (maybe 1981). The Summit Chair (a Cav-Sav) did have a mid-station right about halfway up its length at about the same point as the top of the Birch Glade Chair (see below) and the same elevation as the base of the Summit Poma (I always liked that mid-station as it had a long breakover sheave train into the station immediately followed a long depression train as the really steep part of the lift immediately followed).

Quote

The summit poma was added sometime in the mix as well. As far as lengths for these lifts go, the Lower Double (the first one double chair toward the summit that was built) fits the specs as far as length and vert. Though the date that it was installed doesn't fit. The brochures I looked at showed that the lower double was already installed sometime before 1960 and the summit double was proposed. This would put the Lower Double as being installed in the 50s and the Summit Double in the early to mid sixties as the next map later (1969), shows both of them. The Outpost was installed in 69' and was put in right after the map I looked at was printed. Gnomes Knoll was installed as a triple by Hall in 1972. It also couldn't have been the Little Pico Triple because there is a plaque at the base of it that says it replaced the original Pico T-Bar in 1980.

I skiied Pico during high school and college when I had relatives living in Rutland. I graduated from high school in 1975 and I know the first trip was before then because I remember running into a high school classmate (from New Jersey) there once. By the time of the first visit, Knome's Knoll (I've seen it spelled both ways - G or K) had the triple chair already (but then it was the only triple there so it was just "Triple Chair").

Chairlift.org says the Lower Chair was a 1962 Stadelli but that was not there the first time I went. As I mentioned in the earlier note, the towers I remember don't match the picture.

Quote

Another thing that throws a monkey wrench into this would be the fact that in 1978 Poma installed a double chair (2500ft long, 800ft vert). I don't know where that could have been, but where ever it was it had a good pitch to it.

That is definitely the Birch Glade Chair which was to the right of and parallel to the Summit Chair from bottom of the Summit Chair to the Summit Chair's mid-station. But I think 1978 is too late as that would have meant it was there for only one season of skiing while I was in college and the one post-college trip I made there. It was there more seasons than that as I rode it too many times.

Quote

Trailmap sources http://teachski.com/brochures/state%20maps...ntbrochures.htm Click on links in upper right.

Great link. With one of the brochures having a 4,000 foot distance for the Lower Chair, that does fit with this mystery chair. But I do think the years are off. I think the mystery Hall was earlier in the 70's with the Poma chair more like 1975 or 1976. The Summit Poma came after that as it along with the Birch Glade Chair created an alternate route to the top.

Addendum: Looking some more at chairlift.org, they have slightly different dates - 1971 for the Knome's Knoll Triple and 1977 for Birch Glade with the poma following in 1978. They also put the Summit Chair as 1965 but then indicate it was modified by Dopplemayr in 198? so maybe it did get combined with the Lower Chair (but that would be one mean 9,000 foot chair). Unfortunately, this site is completely missing whatever replaced the original Lower Chair (the 1962 Stadelli I mentioned).

[Jonni]

I think what replaced the Lower Double and the Summit Double as well as the Birch Glade chair, was when ASC put in the Golden Express and the Summit Express in 1987. As the Golden Express goes up to the top of Prospector and Gold Rush, and the Summit Express starts near where the Summit Double started from. Thanks for the information on the other lifts, I will be fixing the install sheets in the next care package that I send to Cameron tomorrow or Wednesday.

[WBSKI]

Ive got 2 corrections for Harper Mountain, BC

1. 1973 Survey - Change T-bar name to Big T-bar
2. 1975 Survey - Change T-bar name to Little T-bar

Im guessing on the 75 survey although im pretty sure im right.