23 replies to this topic

[skiPhreak]

I know that most lifts have auxiliary diesel drives in case of a primary drive failure, but how often are they used? I can't remember any times where I've been skiing and a lift was running on diesel power. It seems to me there would be a lot of extra maintenance for a diesel engine that doesn't run most of the time.

[Mike]

We use them around once or twice a year. The most common cause is some jackass hitting a utility pole in town tripping a public service breaker. It takes public service awhile to restore power. In the mean time, we can run full capacity on diesel without public electric service.
The colorado code also requires at lease two power sources for lifts that are off the ground. The second power source can be a small engine that runs slower to just evac the people or it can be a large diesel that can run all day at full speed. The code also requires to run the diesel motors and do some tests every few days.

This post has been edited by Mike: 27 April 2005 - 03:32 PM

[mmsa]

We start them once a week. for our monthly inspection we hook them up to the lift once a month and run the lift 1 complete lap ,check the controls if it is a full service APU.

[lstone19]

Mike, on Apr 27 2005, 06:29 PM, said:

The second power source can be a small engine that runs slower to just evac the people...

"Slower" is definitely the operative word. Years ago (early 70s?), I was skiing at Pico (VT) and was on the Lower Chair maybe within 10 chairs of the load when the power went out. After a few minutes, we were on our way at a painful crawl as they ran the diesel to evacuate it. 30 or so minutes and now probably no more than 10 chairs from the top, we stopped. A couple of minutes later, we were on our way at full speed as the power was back.

That wasn't my only power failure story there. Another time, I was on their Summit Chair less than two chairs from the top when the power went out. I don't think this lift had a backup engine. Fortunately, I was close enough to the ground that when they decided to evacuate, all it took was dropping the skis and having the lift operator grab my legs and have me make a controlled jump. Everyone else had to wait for the patrol to do it with ropes. Better yet, back then they had a Poma extremely steep surface lift that was only diesel powered and just served the upper mountain (from about the same elevation as the Summit Chair's mid-unloading station). So for the next hour or so, it was the private lift of those of us lucky enough to be caught on the upper mountain and brave enough to ride the thing.

[Aussierob]

Using the stand-by is pretty rare for us now as our power supply is much better than it used to be. They also quite useful if you have a problem with the motor or drive. They are run every 100 hours connected to the lift for testing. Code requires once a month.

[liftmech]

We have the operators run our ifts on APU power once a week, on a rotating basis so everyone is familiar with the operation. Once a month we also run all diesel-powered lifts at least part of the day so that they get a load. Ski areas spend money on diesel upkeep and operation for this very reason: http://www.skilifts....?showtopic=2432 The reason we load public on diesel once a month is so that we can work out the engine, figure out any problems it may have before it's need on a lengthy basis like this example. Of course, we had never run the Bee's diesels for this length of time so we still discovered issues.

[teleski3]

We do our lifts per ansi code b77 30 min. per lift per month.

[Aussierob]

liftmech, on Apr 28 2005, 05:59 AM, said:

We have the operators run our ifts on APU power once a week, <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Do your operators actually hoook the diesel up and run it? Only maintenance guys do it here. Lifty's just stand at the unload like normal.

[vons]

Copper sure does I have run the Aux on all the detachables and many of the fixed chairs too. Last season I had the pleasure of being forman of t-rex ,a doppelmayr HSQ, two bolts a switch and a toggle and then it runs almost the same as it does on the main drive the only differance is you have to hold the slow and fast in to Accel and deccel the lift since the speeds are not preset on aux.

[liftmech]

We have to help some lifties, but yes, we do have them run aux. We don't have a large maintenance staff so we have to enlist help from Operations whenever we can.

[Dr Frankenstein]

I think Mont-Habitant had to run on the aux. 2 or 3 times in three years.

The last time it was in the March break (!), when the South Laurentians (from Laval to St-Sauveur) lost power. I just arrived in the waiting line for my first run when the three lifts stopped at the same time. After 15 minutes (!) they finally started the auxiliary for evacuating. I began hiking the mountain and I was going faster than the chairlift.

They just ran one lift at a time so it took one hour to evacuate the two chairlifts (the third one is a surface lift).

When we finally got power they had a problem with one of the two chairlift so the waiting line was..... very long.

They finally managed to run the second chairlift one hour later. (The time it took to go get the missing part at the Doppelmayr plant and installing it on the chairlift, the plant is just twenty minutes of road from Mont-Habitant)

[Zage]

The Glacier express at Lake Louise runs on the diesel engine to conserve power.

[Allan]

Conserving electricity by running a diesel doesn't make sense to me. You still have to pay for diesel as well as the maintenance on the engine as well!

[liftmech]

Depending upon your hydro company some industrial users have to pay a surcharge if they go over a certain amount of kWh. We used to do that in the fall when snowmaking cranked up; we'd start up on diesel and then when snowmaking shut down for the day we'd go back to electric. I imagine that's what Zage is referring to.

[Allan]

Makes sense - I guess we wouldn't run into that problem, we don't have snowmaking!! Boy could we have used it around the base this winter!

[Bergstrom]

Allan, on May 7 2005, 06:31 PM, said:

Makes sense - I guess we wouldn't run into that problem, we don't have snowmaking!!  Boy could we have used it around the base this winter!
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

In Norway we have to start the motor once a week and running the lift on it once a month (30 days of use). Our gondola uses a diesel and our chairlift a mean ford V8 gas engine. We also have to submit oil samples on regular basis to a lab to look for engine wear.

[Zage]

Ha ha ha, a Ford V8 cool A lot of lifts I have seen have Cummins or Detroit Diesel engines, some Caterpillar's, and I have seen a lift with a Kubota tractor engine. One hsq had a Perkins diesel engine.

[Kicking Horse]

how about a gas engine that only moves the ropeway @ a wooping 2mph...

[skiPhreak]

I've seen some pretty strange engines on rope tows before. It's like some resorts put a car or truck engine in a shack with some wheels and rope.

This post has been edited by skiPhreak: 19 May 2005 - 06:25 PM

[Jonni]

At Mt. Sunapee we run the auxes once a day for a minimum of 5 minutes. Every lift is coupled up once a week to the Aux and run for three laps on a rotating basis. It's Mt. Sunapee's policy that if the Aux doesn't run, than the lift doesn't take any passengers until it does run. We also do two evac drills a year in all on-mountain departments so that if a evac is needed, we can use personnel from not only lifts and ski patrol, but snowmaking, safety services, and the learning center.

As for interesting aux motors, we have a 1963 Mueller double that uses a 12hp Wisconsin Engine. That little bugger starts on the coldest of mornings and has never needed more than an oil change and new spark plugs.