61 replies to this topic

[DonaldMReif]

On most lifts, typically, the style of the terminals is the same generation, thus why Vail's and Beaver Creek's Dopplemayr high speed quads use the chain style CLD-260 style at both ends, or why Keystone's three spring series Dopplemayr high speed quads have first generation UNI terminals at both ends, etc.

However, is it possible to match two different styles together?


I think that it is possible to match two styles together.

Spoiler

(I must give thanks to skierdude9450 here for use of his photographs)

At Big Sky Ski Resort in Montana, there are four Dopplemayr high speed quads, and remember they are the Ramcharger Express, Swift Current Express, Southern Comfort Express, and Thunder Wolf Express lift.


Now, this is where I go into more detail. The Thunderwolf Express lift is a UNI terminal DS series Dopplemayr, but it has some more interesting things in it. When you look at these three pictures here:







You can notice that this lift uses a second generation UNI bottom drive terminal, but the upper terminal uses a UNI first generation return station.

Are there any other lifts like this?

[mikest2]

I believe UNI terminals are (or were) available in a couple of different lengths. You can't have terminals that fit both DS and DT grips. The question is kind of vague.

[SkiBachelor]

mikest2, on Mar 13 2009, 06:05 PM, said:

You can't have terminals that fit both DS and DT grips. The question is kind of vague.

While it's not possible for a lift to support two different types of grips, the Cabriolet at Mont Tremblant features the DS grips with UNI terminals is known for the DT grip. It's probably the only lift with a setup like this.


http://lh6.ggpht.com/_YEZhZdUsD5w/RsBQN1pS...ugust+4+009.jpg
http://www.flickr.co...ya_6/2891124438

[skierdude9450]

Those terminals are no different, and the drive terminal at the bottom is exactly like the tension terminal at the top, however it is the low (compact) structure. It's exactly the same as what you see at Keystone.

[skiersage]

It would be possible two mix different terminal styles as long as grip type, speed, and line gauge were all the same. But will it ever happen? NEVER

[skier691]

skiersage, on Mar 14 2009, 03:42 PM, said:

It would be possible two mix different terminal styles as long as grip type, speed, and line gauge were all the same. But will it ever happen? NEVER

Never?? There are many fixed griped lifts that use different terminals. the Porkies has a lift with a Miner-Denver return and a Ctec drive.

[skiersage]

skier691, on Mar 14 2009, 06:15 PM, said:

Never?? There are many fixed griped lifts that use different terminals. the Porkies has a lift with a Miner-Denver return and a Ctec drive.

Yes that is true but the discussion is about detachable lifts. I have seen many fixed chairs with alternate terminals but not detaches.

[iceberg210]

However it took a while I'm sure for FG lifts to get the hybrid nature to them. IE it wasn't tell much later that one of the two terminals would get upgraded and you would then get a hybrid lift. In the case of HS lifts they still have been around for such a relatively brief period of time we haven't really had the chance to see updates (well except for the YAN replacement modifications etc) so it could be entirely possible that we could see some 'hybrid' lifts in the next decade or so. Maybe a tree falls on one and puts it beyond repair so they put a different skin on top of what is really just the same terminal but with a different look. We've already seen areas like Snowbasin put aesthetic upgrades on their FG's so why not on someone's HS in order to get them all to look the same. Maybe Brighton upgrades the look of Crest to match the other HS's they have on the hill or maybe Solitude upgrades the bottom terminal to Eagle Express to match the new HS they are putting in. Never say never but even if it does happen we may have to wait awhile to see it.

[aug]

On a detachable lift the main component dictating the terminals is the grip design . It does not matter what skin is put over the terminal . There have been many hemorpodites(sic) ( dopple yan). But if you are using a certain grip and they do not magicly change mid flight, both terminals must be able to accept the grip that is on the line . Function is more than skin deep .

[iceberg210]

Exactly, and that's why you'd have to be only changing the outside of it and not the inner workings since changing the inner workings would make you have a non functioning lift, and that's just no good. Having said that however it may be at some point we see some refurbishment, modifications, and modernizations of the HS lifts and at that point we might see a few hybrid stations here and there.

[floridaskier]

I don't really see resorts upgrading terminal skins to match other lifts. Most people are completely oblivious to the lifts' appearance anyway, and for the few people like us who would notice probably won't make the investment worthwhile.

[skier691]

I agree. As the detachables get older and grips start to get worn from millions of openings and closings, I would think areas would start to replace whole systems, ie. both terminals and grips on all chairs. Correct me, but, isnt that what Bachelor did on the Pine Marten? As far as lifts looking the same, I think many areas do want the same theme or look, take Deer Valley, didnt they raise a terminal on one of the detachable out of Snow Park Lodge area, after it was built, just so the two were the same height, or Holiday Valley, NY who put skins on the fixed grips to make them look like the detachs... bla bla bla

[DonaldMReif]

skier691, on Mar 15 2009, 09:44 AM, said:

I agree. As the detachables get older and grips start to get worn from millions of openings and closings, I would think areas would start to replace whole systems, ie. both terminals and grips on all chairs. Correct me, but, isnt that what Bachelor did on the Pine Marten? As far as lifts looking the same, I think many areas do want the same theme or look, take Deer Valley, didnt they raise a terminal on one of the detachable out of Snow Park Lodge area, after it was built, just so the two were the same height, or Holiday Valley, NY who put skins on the fixed grips to make them look like the detachs... bla bla bla

Speaking of which, when I go back to the pictures of the Pine Marten Express (Current Lifts) and the Pine Marten Express (Removed Lifts), I can see what you're saying. Doppelmayr built the Pine Marten Express lift in 1986, unique because it could be raised or lowered for snow depths. Then in 2006, Doppelmayr rebuilt the lift, reusing the original towers and chairs, but with new grips and terminals, and a new portal assembly.

[skierdude9450]

floridaskier, on Mar 15 2009, 09:02 AM, said:

I don't really see resorts upgrading terminal skins to match other lifts. Most people are completely oblivious to the lifts' appearance anyway, and for the few people like us who would notice probably won't make the investment worthwhile.

Well there have been a few to speak of. The gondola at Lake Louise is a Poma, however it uses a Leitner skin. I think the reasoning behind that had more to do with the fact that the terminals from the original gondola at Squaw Valley were completely enclosed structures that couldn't really be moved, so they had to create some skin for the terminals. The closest to a hybrid that I've seen are the Doppel-Yans at Mammoth which use the original terminal skin, but have been adapted for the new grips. (I don't know how much of the inner workings have been replaced.)

[Outback]

skierdude9450, on Mar 15 2009, 10:21 AM, said:

Well there have been a few to speak of. The gondola at Lake Louise is a Poma, however it uses a Leitner skin. I think the reasoning behind that had more to do with the fact that the terminals from the original gondola at Squaw Valley were completely enclosed structures that couldn't really be moved, so they had to create some skin for the terminals. The closest to a hybrid that I've seen are the Doppel-Yans at Mammoth which use the original terminal skin, but have been adapted for the new grips. (I don't know how much of the inner workings have been replaced.)

Its all about the grips, rails and tires.
Doesn't matter how it goes roundy round or puts on the binders.

[brad82]

In theory, a different terminal can be used, so long as the grip equipment/tire assembly, and rail channels are the same in both terminals. I guess this wont be done unless using a custom terminal, as the terminals (I assume) are designed to fit the equipment...

This configuration is common for UNI type terminals (in europe anyway) I guess its cause the top terminal doesnt require all the drive machinery, therefore not requiring such a large station

This post has been edited by brad82: 19 April 2009 - 12:02 PM

[aug]

[quote name='brad82' post='85162' date='Apr 19 2009, 01:00 PM']In theory, a different terminal can be used, so long as the grip equipment/tire assembly, and rail channels are the same in both terminals. I guess this wont be done unless using a custom terminal, as the terminals (I assume) are designed to fit the equipment...

This has nothing to do with theory .... Grips dictate terminal design..... fact ...... period! if the lift is using a DT 104 grip. then that is what the terminal is designed for , AG grips, AK grips , Omega grips, TB grips , DS grips , etc, etc. Yan terminal with dopp elements = dopp grips.

This post has been edited by aug: 19 April 2009 - 06:57 PM

[Skier123]

This may sound like a really stupid question, because I don't know a lot about Yan high speed quads, but I think the Grand Summit Express at Mount Snow uses a Yan bottom terminal and a Poma Challenger drive terminal. Is this correct? Or is the bottom terminal some type of Poma design?

Here's the bottom:
 GrandSummitExpressBottom.jpg (61.31K)
Number of downloads: 232

And here's the top:
 GrandSummitExpressTop.jpg (51.09K)
Number of downloads: 202

[Jonni]

For the Grand Summit Express originally the whole lift was a Yan, but was retrofitted by Poma. Both terminals have Yan attributes to them, it's just that the bottom return terminal still has more of those attributes than the top terminal. I'm not 100% sure of the specifics, but I know that both terminals have been modified to a certain extent.

[LiftTech]

Both terminals are the same in regards to the grip conveying system; the drive just has a roof, trolley system, lights and heat and was installed after the retro.