Mt Becher is most likely Forbidden Plateau. They had two T-bars up there and i know for sure one was a Mueller. probably all lifts were muellers cause the chair was too. See my avatar.
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1978 Lift Installation Survey Help
Started by SkiBachelor, Aug 27 2005 08:38 PM
153 replies to this topic
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Posted 10 September 2005 - 06:27 AM
1973 Survey - Berkshire East...the 400 or so vertical double would be the Exhibition Double most likely.
Both doubles where never completed. The larger one had the footings and building put in place for the bottom terminal and the smaller one had footings and towers installed.
Bankruptcy and new ownership soon followed.
Both doubles where never completed. The larger one had the footings and building put in place for the bottom terminal and the smaller one had footings and towers installed.
Bankruptcy and new ownership soon followed.
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Posted 10 September 2005 - 06:41 AM
Silver King Ski Club is Whitewater, it was the first year for Whitewater. Summit Chair, it says two Riblets were installed but maybe one was installed in 1974 or something. They were reenginnered and came from the Spokane World Fair.
Easter Chair at Kimberley
Easter Chair at Kimberley
This post has been edited by WBSKI: 10 September 2005 - 07:31 AM
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Posted 10 September 2005 - 07:28 AM
Regarding the 1975 & 1976 Colorado installs:
In 1975: Winter Park had 4 installs, they were the double chairs at Mary Jane (this was the year Mary Jane opened). The lifts were Iron Horse, Pony Express, Challenger, and Galloping Goose all Heron-Poma double chairs and amazingly all still there.
In 1976, the Lionshead gondola had a tragic accident when two cars slammed togther and killed several people when they fell out of them. (The old gondola was way up there!). This gondola was actually built in 1970 according to plackard which was displayed in the former lower terminal building and had 6-person cabins. The 4- person cabin was actually the Village Gondola which ran where the current #16 (Vista Bahn runs) and was removed in 1976 when the double chair #16 was installed.
Also in 1976, I am positive the Packsaddle 2 chair was already there, however, it was shortened (lower terminal moved up the mountain to its current location) when Go Devil was installed. The Packsaddle lift was installed in 1974.
In 1975: Winter Park had 4 installs, they were the double chairs at Mary Jane (this was the year Mary Jane opened). The lifts were Iron Horse, Pony Express, Challenger, and Galloping Goose all Heron-Poma double chairs and amazingly all still there.
In 1976, the Lionshead gondola had a tragic accident when two cars slammed togther and killed several people when they fell out of them. (The old gondola was way up there!). This gondola was actually built in 1970 according to plackard which was displayed in the former lower terminal building and had 6-person cabins. The 4- person cabin was actually the Village Gondola which ran where the current #16 (Vista Bahn runs) and was removed in 1976 when the double chair #16 was installed.
Also in 1976, I am positive the Packsaddle 2 chair was already there, however, it was shortened (lower terminal moved up the mountain to its current location) when Go Devil was installed. The Packsaddle lift was installed in 1974.
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Posted 10 September 2005 - 05:42 PM
Bill, on Sep 9 2005, 11:48 PM, said:
The lift built at Stevens Pass in 1976 might have replaced the old Seventh Heaven lift because I remember seeing an old postcard on Ebay that showed an old Riblet at Stevens Pass with wooden towers. But it would probably be best to contact Stevens Pass to just make sure.
jclark, on Sep 10 2005, 7:27 AM, said:
1973 Survey - Berkshire East...the 400 or so vertical double would be the Exhibition Double most likely.
Both doubles where never completed. The larger one had the footings and building put in place for the bottom terminal and the smaller one had footings and towers installed.
Bankruptcy and new ownership soon followed.
Both doubles where never completed. The larger one had the footings and building put in place for the bottom terminal and the smaller one had footings and towers installed.
Bankruptcy and new ownership soon followed.
If the lifts at Berkshire East were never actually installed, I will remove them from the list.
P.S. That's actually the 1972 install survey. SAM goofed up with one of the old issues and I will change that shortly.
WBSKI, on Sep 10 2005, 7:41 AM, said:
Silver King Ski Club is Whitewater, it was the first year for Whitewater. Summit Chair, it says two Riblets were installed but maybe one was installed in 1974 or something. They were reenginnered and came from the Spokane World Fair.
Thanks about the name change. There were actually two Riblet doubles at Expo 74 in Spokane. Vail purchased one (Gopher Hill I believe) and I guess Whitewater got the other, but Whitewater also purchased a new lift from Riblet that same year. That's why only one Riblet lift (the new one that was purchased) is on the installation sheet since SAM does not list relocated lifts.
boardski, on Sep 10 2005, 8:28 AM, said:
In 1975: Winter Park had 4 installs, they were the double chairs at Mary Jane (this was the year Mary Jane opened). The lifts were Iron Horse, Pony Express, Challenger, and Galloping Goose all Heron-Poma double chairs and amazingly all still there.
In 1976, the Lionshead gondola had a tragic accident when two cars slammed togther and killed several people when they fell out of them. (The old gondola was way up there!). This gondola was actually built in 1970 according to plackard which was displayed in the former lower terminal building and had 6-person cabins. The 4- person cabin was actually the Village Gondola which ran where the current #16 (Vista Bahn runs) and was removed in 1976 when the double chair #16 was installed.
Also in 1976, I am positive the Packsaddle 2 chair was already there, however, it was shortened (lower terminal moved up the mountain to its current location) when Go Devil was installed. The Packsaddle lift was installed in 1974.
In 1976, the Lionshead gondola had a tragic accident when two cars slammed togther and killed several people when they fell out of them. (The old gondola was way up there!). This gondola was actually built in 1970 according to plackard which was displayed in the former lower terminal building and had 6-person cabins. The 4- person cabin was actually the Village Gondola which ran where the current #16 (Vista Bahn runs) and was removed in 1976 when the double chair #16 was installed.
Also in 1976, I am positive the Packsaddle 2 chair was already there, however, it was shortened (lower terminal moved up the mountain to its current location) when Go Devil was installed. The Packsaddle lift was installed in 1974.
The lifts installed at Winter Park were actually installed in 1974 instead of 1975. That's why you don't see them on the list.
I also believe that two lifts replaced the old gondola were Giant Steps and one other one. But then again, the towers on Giant Steps are an older crossarm design prior 1976 so the lifts that were installed in 76 might have just run the current Vista Bahn route.
Yes, there weas a lift isntalled at Keystone in 1974. So if that was Packsaddle, then Packsaddle two had to be the one in 76 then since a resort would probably not list Packsaddle 2 before Packsaddle was built.
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Posted 10 September 2005 - 06:42 PM
The Stevens Pass lift is Tye Mill, it was in their timeline on their site awhile ago
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Posted 10 September 2005 - 06:56 PM
Quote
Back in the winter or 1937-38, Stevens Pass was started by two young men from Seattle, Don Adams and Bruce Kehr, both passionate skiers. With a permit from the U.S. Forest Service in hand, they cleared some big trees on Big Chief Mountain and built the area's first rope tow. An old Ford V-8 engine, assorted wheels and shafts and some sturdy rope they purchased for $600 were used to construct this fancy contraption that pulled skiers up the hill.
Their start was slow since the area, at that time, was not fully accessible in the wintertime. The road was closed at Scenic on the West side. Perseverant skiers either hiked six miles to the area or bought an eighteen cent, one-way rail ticket for passage through Cascade Tunnel on the Great Northern Passenger Train. From there, they were transported to the area on an old school bus. That first season, each ride on the tow was five cents and the partners gross ticket sales were just $88.
The original lodge, built in 1937 by the Civilian Conservation Corps (CCC), a depression era work force, was destroyed by fire in 1939. In 1940 skiers, desperately wanting a new lodge, pitched in to help Kehr and Adams build a new lodge that became known as the T-Bar Lodge.
A new beginner tow was added for the 1941-42 season. Plans for a second new tow were mothballed when Kehr and Adams were called to help the war effort. During their absence, a mutual friend, who had hurt his leg skiing, took over area operations. Upon their return in 1945, two new beginner tows were added on Big Chief Mountain; an intermediate tow was installed on Cowboy Mountain.
With new found prosperity after the war, the area was expanding quickly and the sport becoming more popular. So, in 1947 the partners, along with new partner John Caley, embarked on their biggest and most costly project to date - the mile long T-Bar lift that was installed on Cowboy Mountain at a cost of $100,000
The heyday of the rope tows ended in the late 1950's. The chair had proven far superior. In 1952, the T-Bar was replaced by the first rubber tired, double chair in the Northwest. The Blue Jay chair was built in 1956 followed by Seventh Heaven chairlift in 1960. Extending nearly to the top of Cowboy Mountain, Seventh Heaven changed the character of the area by opening up some of the most advanced skiing terrain on the mountain. That year saw a change in ownership as well. Don Adams, an original partner, sold his interest to Kehr and Caley.
In 1964, Big Chief, the fourth chair, was added, replacing rope tows No. 1 - 4. When several skiers complained about the $4 chair lift price, the No. 1 rope was re-installed. However, it operated for only two more seasons. Technology had truly made its mark; skiers were willing to pay more for the convenience of the chairlift.
Thus, more chairs were added. Brooks chair in 1968 and Daisy, a triple chair, were added in 1973 to serve the growing number of beginners. In 1976, Stevens purchased its seventh lift from the nearby, defunct Yodelin Ski area. The chair, now known as Tye-Mill, was upgraded and brought to Stevens by helicopter. That year, a three million dollar sewer system went on line, ending the "no growth" moratorium and paving the way for a badly needed new day lodge. And, after nearly 40 years at the helm, Kehr and Caley sold the popular ski area to Seattle based Harbor Properties.
Following the tradition of expansion and growth, Harbor Properties con-structed a second day lodge in 1978. The following year, the hard-work-ing Hogsback triple chair was added to ease lift line congestion. To access the pristine, more advanced terrain of the Mill Valley area, the Double Diamond and Southern Cross chairlifts were added in 1987. A third day lodge was constructed in 1988 to enhance ski area amenities and provide needed office space. In 1989, twenty small huts housing the many area ski schools were replaced with the construction of a new Ski School Center.
Night skiing became a more important part of the operation in 1990 when lights were added to the Hogsback triple chairlift. The 1992-93 season saw the opening of the Nordic Center, located just 5 miles east of the main area, featuring 25 km of groomed trails with tracked trails, a skating lane and The Cascade Depot offering rentals, accessories, lessons and light snacks. In 1993, the Jupiter chair was built in Mill Valley to expand that area's skiable terrain and lessen lift lines. The Tye-Mill lift was lighted in 1994, adding four more major runs to the night skiing lineup.
The SkyLine Express, the first high-speed quad chair at Stevens was added in 1996. It was the first lighted high-speed quad in Washington, and boosted both day and night operations at Stevens. In 1998 the Hogsback Express was installed, the area's second high-speed lift, quickly becoming Stevens' most popular chairlift with outstanding day and night terrain for skiing and snowboarding.
In 1999 Stevens embarked on its busiest summer ever with projects on the mountain and in the base area. An 8.2 million dollar re-development of the base area has included the new Granite Peaks Lodge, a surrounding plaza and inviting entry ways, and extensive remodeling of the Tye Creek and Pacific Crest Lodges. In addition the Tye-Mill lift was re-built, giving guests a modern, triple chair.
The original owners and visionaries of Stevens Pass are long gone, but their legacy continues. Today, just as pioneering Kehr, Adams and Caley sought to enhance the enjoyment of the sport, Harbor Resorts continues that commitment. Older chairlifts will continue to be replaced by modern lifts like the Hogsback Express and the Tye-Mill triple. As we enter a new century Stevens will be forming a new Master Plan, which will guide the resort's development for the next ten to fifteen years, continuing the goal of providing guests with the best possible winter experience.
Their start was slow since the area, at that time, was not fully accessible in the wintertime. The road was closed at Scenic on the West side. Perseverant skiers either hiked six miles to the area or bought an eighteen cent, one-way rail ticket for passage through Cascade Tunnel on the Great Northern Passenger Train. From there, they were transported to the area on an old school bus. That first season, each ride on the tow was five cents and the partners gross ticket sales were just $88.
The original lodge, built in 1937 by the Civilian Conservation Corps (CCC), a depression era work force, was destroyed by fire in 1939. In 1940 skiers, desperately wanting a new lodge, pitched in to help Kehr and Adams build a new lodge that became known as the T-Bar Lodge.
A new beginner tow was added for the 1941-42 season. Plans for a second new tow were mothballed when Kehr and Adams were called to help the war effort. During their absence, a mutual friend, who had hurt his leg skiing, took over area operations. Upon their return in 1945, two new beginner tows were added on Big Chief Mountain; an intermediate tow was installed on Cowboy Mountain.
With new found prosperity after the war, the area was expanding quickly and the sport becoming more popular. So, in 1947 the partners, along with new partner John Caley, embarked on their biggest and most costly project to date - the mile long T-Bar lift that was installed on Cowboy Mountain at a cost of $100,000
The heyday of the rope tows ended in the late 1950's. The chair had proven far superior. In 1952, the T-Bar was replaced by the first rubber tired, double chair in the Northwest. The Blue Jay chair was built in 1956 followed by Seventh Heaven chairlift in 1960. Extending nearly to the top of Cowboy Mountain, Seventh Heaven changed the character of the area by opening up some of the most advanced skiing terrain on the mountain. That year saw a change in ownership as well. Don Adams, an original partner, sold his interest to Kehr and Caley.
In 1964, Big Chief, the fourth chair, was added, replacing rope tows No. 1 - 4. When several skiers complained about the $4 chair lift price, the No. 1 rope was re-installed. However, it operated for only two more seasons. Technology had truly made its mark; skiers were willing to pay more for the convenience of the chairlift.
Thus, more chairs were added. Brooks chair in 1968 and Daisy, a triple chair, were added in 1973 to serve the growing number of beginners. In 1976, Stevens purchased its seventh lift from the nearby, defunct Yodelin Ski area. The chair, now known as Tye-Mill, was upgraded and brought to Stevens by helicopter. That year, a three million dollar sewer system went on line, ending the "no growth" moratorium and paving the way for a badly needed new day lodge. And, after nearly 40 years at the helm, Kehr and Caley sold the popular ski area to Seattle based Harbor Properties.
Following the tradition of expansion and growth, Harbor Properties con-structed a second day lodge in 1978. The following year, the hard-work-ing Hogsback triple chair was added to ease lift line congestion. To access the pristine, more advanced terrain of the Mill Valley area, the Double Diamond and Southern Cross chairlifts were added in 1987. A third day lodge was constructed in 1988 to enhance ski area amenities and provide needed office space. In 1989, twenty small huts housing the many area ski schools were replaced with the construction of a new Ski School Center.
Night skiing became a more important part of the operation in 1990 when lights were added to the Hogsback triple chairlift. The 1992-93 season saw the opening of the Nordic Center, located just 5 miles east of the main area, featuring 25 km of groomed trails with tracked trails, a skating lane and The Cascade Depot offering rentals, accessories, lessons and light snacks. In 1993, the Jupiter chair was built in Mill Valley to expand that area's skiable terrain and lessen lift lines. The Tye-Mill lift was lighted in 1994, adding four more major runs to the night skiing lineup.
The SkyLine Express, the first high-speed quad chair at Stevens was added in 1996. It was the first lighted high-speed quad in Washington, and boosted both day and night operations at Stevens. In 1998 the Hogsback Express was installed, the area's second high-speed lift, quickly becoming Stevens' most popular chairlift with outstanding day and night terrain for skiing and snowboarding.
In 1999 Stevens embarked on its busiest summer ever with projects on the mountain and in the base area. An 8.2 million dollar re-development of the base area has included the new Granite Peaks Lodge, a surrounding plaza and inviting entry ways, and extensive remodeling of the Tye Creek and Pacific Crest Lodges. In addition the Tye-Mill lift was re-built, giving guests a modern, triple chair.
The original owners and visionaries of Stevens Pass are long gone, but their legacy continues. Today, just as pioneering Kehr, Adams and Caley sought to enhance the enjoyment of the sport, Harbor Resorts continues that commitment. Older chairlifts will continue to be replaced by modern lifts like the Hogsback Express and the Tye-Mill triple. As we enter a new century Stevens will be forming a new Master Plan, which will guide the resort's development for the next ten to fifteen years, continuing the goal of providing guests with the best possible winter experience.
Tye Mill - Riblet Double brought up from Yodelin in 1976.
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Posted 10 September 2005 - 07:22 PM
Alright then, I'm going to mark this lift on the list as a relocation since that's what it is rather than a new installation. However, if a new drive terminal was added, then it might be classified as a new lift.
It's rather hard to identify if a lift is new or not. I know that when the Midway and Summit chairs at Willamette Pass were installed, SAM only listed the Summit chair being a new lift saying that since both Midway and Summit were made from former lift parts, they weren't new really new lifts. However, everything was new except for the towers which were reused. But we see a lot of new lifts reusing old towers these days since they're still in good condition and it's too expensive to buy new ones for what it's worth.
P.S. Does anyone know when the Tye Mill lift was upgraded to a triple? I don't ever recall seeing it in SAM Magazine.
Cameron
It's rather hard to identify if a lift is new or not. I know that when the Midway and Summit chairs at Willamette Pass were installed, SAM only listed the Summit chair being a new lift saying that since both Midway and Summit were made from former lift parts, they weren't new really new lifts. However, everything was new except for the towers which were reused. But we see a lot of new lifts reusing old towers these days since they're still in good condition and it's too expensive to buy new ones for what it's worth.
P.S. Does anyone know when the Tye Mill lift was upgraded to a triple? I don't ever recall seeing it in SAM Magazine.
Cameron
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Posted 10 September 2005 - 08:43 PM
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In 1999 Stevens embarked on its busiest summer ever with projects on the mountain and in the base area. An 8.2 million dollar re-development of the base area has included the new Granite Peaks Lodge, a surrounding plaza and inviting entry ways, and extensive remodeling of the Tye Creek and Pacific Crest Lodges. In addition the Tye-Mill lift was re-built, giving guests a modern, triple chair.
That was done in 1999 with a new Riblet drive and triple chairs.
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Posted 10 September 2005 - 08:46 PM
Ok so they waited a year from removing Hogsback to re installing it
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Posted 11 September 2005 - 06:15 AM
SkiBachelor, on Sep 10 2005, 07:42 PM, said:
The lifts installed at Winter Park were actually installed in 1974 instead of 1975. That's why you don't see them on the list.
I also believe that two lifts replaced the old gondola were Giant Steps and one other one. But then again, the towers on Giant Steps are an older crossarm design prior 1976 so the lifts that were installed in 76 might have just run the current Vista Bahn route.
Yes, there weas a lift isntalled at Keystone in 1974. So if that was Packsaddle, then Packsaddle two had to be the one in 76 then since a resort would probably not list Packsaddle 2 before Packsaddle was built.
I also believe that two lifts replaced the old gondola were Giant Steps and one other one. But then again, the towers on Giant Steps are an older crossarm design prior 1976 so the lifts that were installed in 76 might have just run the current Vista Bahn route.
Yes, there weas a lift isntalled at Keystone in 1974. So if that was Packsaddle, then Packsaddle two had to be the one in 76 then since a resort would probably not list Packsaddle 2 before Packsaddle was built.
I will check with some old Keystone folks on the origin of Packsaddle. The name was changed to Packsaddle II sometime in the 90's when they renamed Go Devil to Packsaddle I because they thought the name intimidated beginners/imtermediates from riding it up to the gentler terain above. In the NSAA database, confirmed in a conversation with Sid Roslund, Packsaddle II is listed as a 1976 YAN. More to follow.
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Posted 11 September 2005 - 08:25 PM
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Posted 12 September 2005 - 12:37 PM
1974 Installs:
Sunshine - STRAWBERRY
Marmot - RED-T
Also:
Silver Summit is mispelled.
Sunshine - STRAWBERRY
Marmot - RED-T
Also:
Silver Summit is mispelled.
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Posted 12 September 2005 - 12:55 PM
Since we were curious about what year that Packsaddle lift was isntalled at Keystone, the original one was installed in 1974. However on the 1976 LE Installation sheet, it lists the Packsaddle lift again again but instead of the term NEW for new lift, the term RTT is used.
Does anyone have any ideas what RTT means?
Does anyone have any ideas what RTT means?
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Posted 12 September 2005 - 03:39 PM
Damm it! I could have seen that double when i was up at mt arrowsmith. if only i had known. I wonder if the Elkford ski hill is now Wapiti Ski Hill. I just googled it so no guarantees
Wapiti Ski Hill (Elkford) T-bar is Moose Caboose
Wapiti Ski Hill (Elkford) T-bar is Moose Caboose
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Posted 13 September 2005 - 08:21 AM
SkiBachelor, on Sep 10 2005, 07:42 PM, said:
The lifts installed at Winter Park were actually installed in 1974 instead of 1975. That's why you don't see them on the list.
I also believe that two lifts replaced the old gondola were Giant Steps and one other one. But then again, the towers on Giant Steps are an older crossarm design prior 1976 so the lifts that were installed in 76 might have just run the current Vista Bahn route.
Yes, there weas a lift isntalled at Keystone in 1974. So if that was Packsaddle, then Packsaddle two had to be the one in 76 then since a resort would probably not list Packsaddle 2 before Packsaddle was built.
I also believe that two lifts replaced the old gondola were Giant Steps and one other one. But then again, the towers on Giant Steps are an older crossarm design prior 1976 so the lifts that were installed in 76 might have just run the current Vista Bahn route.
Yes, there weas a lift isntalled at Keystone in 1974. So if that was Packsaddle, then Packsaddle two had to be the one in 76 then since a resort would probably not list Packsaddle 2 before Packsaddle was built.
There were actually 3 lifts installed in that general area replacing the old Vail Village Gondola according to Pte Seibert's book "Triumph of a Dream", they were lift 16, a Yan double chair which originated where the current Vista Bahn is and ran about half the length. Lift 17, another Yan double chair originated where platter tow #27 is now and ran to the top of where the current Avanti Express upper terminal is. Lift 2 was yet a third Yan double which ran paralell to lift 17 orignating where the lower terminal of the current Avanti express is now and terminating just to the right of the top of Avanti. lifts 2 & 17 replaced the original lift 2, a Riblet double chair installed in 1964.
Regarding Packsaddle 2, The original lift which was much longer and originated in a lower location on the mountain with the same upper terminal location (See old ski maps on "www.coloradoskihistory.com"), was called "Packsaddle" The name was changed to "Packsaddle 2" when the name of the Go Devil lift was changed to Packsaddle 1 sometime in the early 80's. I think that may leave us with an unidentified '76 install. Did Keystone install any other chairs that year that were removed soon after or was there another ski area which installed a Yan double in '76 that might have been credited to Keystone?
Since the signs announcing the improvements at Mary Jane which were posted last season stated "Mary Jane is Turning 30" , I assumed those Heron- Poma double chairs were installed in '75. Maybe they were built in '74 and opened in '75 (similar to how Blue sky Basin at Vail was built). Incidently, did you know that when the board of trustees voted to build Mary Jane back in 1973, the measure only passed by 1 vote (thank goodness it passed!)
SkiBachelor, on Sep 12 2005, 02:55 PM, said:
Since we were curious about what year that Packsaddle lift was isntalled at Keystone, the original one was installed in 1974. However on the 1976 LE Installation sheet, it lists the Packsaddle lift again again but instead of the term NEW for new lift, the term RTT is used.
Does anyone have any ideas what RTT means?
Does anyone have any ideas what RTT means?
"Relocated top terminal"- altough the Packsaddle chair had the bottom terminal relocated
SkiBachelor, on Sep 11 2005, 10:25 PM, said:
The 4th Heron-Poma double at Mary Jane in Colorado is the Iron Horse, the double chair at Arapahoe Basin is the original Lenaway lift and the lift at Vail is lift #11 (the original Northwoods chair). Bashor lift at Steamboat is a very unique design. Not many more of the raised drives & bottom stations left anymore. They were pretty cool.
This post has been edited by boardski: 13 September 2005 - 08:22 AM
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