174 replies to this topic

[Smacpats]

ccslider, on 30 May 2016 - 09:45 AM, said:

3. Reduce L-4 from 2800 pph to 2400 pph and put the extra chairs on L-14 and L-11. L-4 can't operate at 2800 pph because lower ability level skiers are not used to the minimal chair interval and the lift slows and stops often. Both L-14 and L-11 get very busy and are designed to handle more capacity then they current operate at.

8. Terrain expansion into Upper Bear Creek with lifts into East Bear Creek and Lena Basin and a Delta Bowl return. This may not be too popular an idea with the backcountry skiers who like to ride these areas but it is something that ski area management and the USFS should take a look at with the advent of global warming and its likely affect on the shortening of ski seasons and rising elevation of snow levels. The day will come when like a lot of European resorts, the base area lifts will become access lifts to the good skiing in the high alpine and Upper Bear Creek can provide that type of terrain.

Or just replace Lift 4 with a six (2,800 P/h capacity, same as current but easier to load because bigger spacing), and move the current lift 4 to Upper Bear Creek. If the lift in Bear Creek is still above 2,400 P/h, move any extra chairs to 14 and 11.

[machskier]

ceo, on 23 May 2016 - 02:15 AM, said:

I've been kicking around this idea for Sugarloaf for a while, predicated on the idea that some extremely rich person buys the place and decides to drop $20mil or so on expansion. Here's what it looks like. Basic elements are:

• New Gondola, on a slightly different alignment so it can be off to the side of Gondola Line and better sheltered from wind, and also because Sugarloaf is building a new Competition Center on the site of the old one, which previously had been the old Gondola base station.
  
• Replacement for the Double Runner lift, which shouldn't actually be called Single Runner (Double Runner is a double-double for most of its length). Moved to in front of the base lodge so it no longer needs to be hiked to; provides access to #3 T-bar as well as Skyline. Either a detachable or a fixie with a loading carpet.
  
• Detachable quad replacing Bucksaw, and another replacing West Mountain.
  
• New trail and glade pods on both sides of West Mountain so there's actually a reason to go over there.
  
• Detachable quad from Bullwinkle's (lodge at top of Bucksaw and West Mountain) to the summit. Has an angle station at the base of the current Timberline lift (which this one replaces) and follows its alignment from there.
  
• Detachable quad replacing King Pine, starting some distance lower to provide better access out of Brackett Basin.
  
• Detachable Poma from base of King Pine to summit of Burnt Mountain, with a turn because of topography and also because I'm excessively fond of old-school Poma lifts that go around corners.
  
• Trail pod off the west side of Burnt Mountain Poma, with access trail going behind the ridge from top of King Pine. Existing Brackett Basin glades still require hiking the ridge.
  
• Long, winding trail from Burnt Mountain summit on the far east side, with everything between it and the Poma as sidecountry.

I think $20mil would only get you half your plan. Sugarloaf does not need a new base to summit gondolla. Too windy for a single cable and too pricey for a 3S type. Plus, advanced/expert don't want to constantly ski the runout and most days beginner/intermediate don't want to ski the entire length. I think replace super quad with HSS, move superquad to replace timberline and make so you can catch at Bullies should do it.
As for Burnt, you must be careful with a surface lift. The new regs don't allow crossing the line when skiing, so you could cut the terrain in half if it doesn't go up on boundary edge. I don't think Boyne will dump Sugarloaf, but of the 3 New England areas, I think Loon gets the most $$ in the next 5 due to other development in town and need to finish off South Peak beginner pod and true base.

[liftmech]

Which new regulations are you referring to? We have a surface lift, only three seasons old, which has a skier crossing.

[Smacpats]

Today I just realized how stupid the Philosophy of the Kidderbrook area is. It has the only trail above a green traverse that is over a mile-long on the entire mountain (not counting upper and lower runs together), and to lap it you have to take a ~4,000 foot traverse which will take around 8 minutes (you aren't going more than 3 MPH on this thing, it's flat) and take ~8,000 feet of lifts (takes 10 mins with AVG stops, on a weekday or day with no crowds this is cut down to 7). Meaning on an AVG weekend Saturday, it takes 16 minutes to simply get back to the top of a 5,000 foot long run. thats 7 minutes of trash (subtracting how much time it would take if a HSQ was just there). At that rate, it's better to just ski two runs under the Sunrise express and get a 2,800 vertical drop in 10 minutes instead of Kidderbrook where you get 1,900 vertical drop in 16 minutes.

And don't get me started on the time required to ski trails like Kidderbrook Ravine, Vertigo, the lower half of Bear down (The trail has a traverse halfway down to cut over to civilization) and Free Fall. 12 minutes of Traverse, 10 minutes of lift, 22 minute lap (not even including the run, which would be about 2 minutes on Free Fall, 4-6 minutes on Ravine and 2.5 on Vertigo! Would you fancy a half hour lap? A HSQ would cut that 28 down to a 10-15. A 15 minute lap is reasonable, a 28 minute lap is laughable.

I heard Crystal has plans* Rainier with a six-pack. Why not buy that lift, install it on Kidderbrook line (they would need to buy 8-10 new towers to make up for the length difference, the capacity using all of Rainier's chairs would be approx. 1,800 P/h, more than enough for that line).

This post has been edited by Smacpats: 01 June 2016 - 01:06 PM

[liftmech]

Where/from whom did you hear the bit about Crystal replacing Rex? News to me.

[NHskier13]

If they are I hope it gets reinstalled somewhere else. I have a thing for the 1988 poma's by now lol
Also isn't crystal a boyne resort? It could possibly be brought to another resort of boyne's if needed

[Sacdelic_Skier]

I would think Snowqualmie since they are like the only boyne are besides sunday river with pomas and they need "new" lifts

[NHskier13]

I wonder if lifts like Rainer are having similar problems to @liftmech's flyer, that would probably dictate whether it is moved or scrapped

[Smacpats]

liftmech, on 31 May 2016 - 07:46 PM, said:

Where/from whom did you hear the bit about Crystal replacing Rex? News to me.

Quote

By now Crystal has implemented much of its 2004 master plan but a handful of lift projects remain on the horizon. Two aging lifts still need to be replaced. Rainier Express was Crystal’s first detachable, opened in 1988, and is nearing the end of its useful life. The plan is to replace it eventually, possibly with a six-pack. The Discovery beginner lift is also slated to be replaced with a more learning-friendly and extended high speed quad.

This is from Peter's blog, here is the link: https://liftblog.com...1/#comment-1748

Even though it says eventually, I can see that happening soon.
I put in my post that Crystal is replacing Rex, although what I meant was that they are planning to soon replace it.

This post has been edited by Smacpats: 01 June 2016 - 01:07 PM

[snoloco]

My plan for Stratton is as follows.

Snow Bowl Quad replaced with 6-pack called Snow Bowl Express.

Snow Bowl would be relocated to provide direct access out of Lot 2 and ski in ski out access to the condos around there.

HSQ on Kidderbrook and an additional trail cut.

Sunrise dropped below treeline.

Shooting Star would run weekends and holidays only and there would be a sign directing people to use URSA or Kidderbrook to access the same runs.

[Sacdelic_Skier]

my stratton plan:

Relocate Shooting Star to Snowbowl reusing some towers

Replace the gondola with a new 8 person gondola reusing cabins and tower tubes

Relocate Snowbowl to North American

New SMS poma

Replace AMEX with an 8 pack

Relocate AMEX to Kidderbrook with new towers

[Smacpats]

Sacdelic_Skier, on 01 June 2016 - 02:35 PM, said:

my stratton plan:

Relocate Shooting Star to Snowbowl reusing some towers

Replace AMEX with an 8 pack

Relocate AMEX to Kidderbrook with new towers

These three are the ones I disagree with. Shooting Star pod is only lappable by Shooting Star and Ursa, the latter which is a circus on weekends. I think the solution is to keep Shooting Star where it is (maybe take off and sell some chairs) buy a new HSS for Snowbowl and HSQ for Kidderbrook. Amex does not need an eight pack. Put a carpet on South American and Tamarack and smother the base area and village with signs pointing toward them.

[Smacpats]

snoloco, on 01 June 2016 - 01:13 PM, said:

My plan for Stratton is as follows.

Snow Bowl Quad replaced with 6-pack called Snow Bowl Express.

Snow Bowl would be relocated to provide direct access out of Lot 2 and ski in ski out access to the condos around there.

HSQ on Kidderbrook and an additional trail cut.

Sunrise dropped below treeline.

Shooting Star would run weekends and holidays only and there would be a sign directing people to use URSA or Kidderbrook to access the same runs.

I agree with this, but I think a better idea for lot 2 access would be a T-bar terminating on Big Ben. This would popularize the sunbowl, because everyone from Lot 2 would end up there.

They could use Snowbowl quad as a possible expansion somewhat like this (lift on upper left side is former Snowbowl quad, the lift on the right side is Kidderbrook express, everything else is trails):
http://i.imgur.com/Js4jbIk.png
http://i.imgur.com/62DWMlO.png

This post has been edited by Smacpats: 01 June 2016 - 05:40 PM

[Sacdelic_Skier]

Smacpats, on 01 June 2016 - 05:27 PM, said:

These three are the ones I disagree with. Shooting Star pod is only lappable by Shooting Star and Ursa, the latter which is a circus on weekends. I think the solution is to keep Shooting Star where it is (maybe take off and sell some chairs) buy a new HSS for Snowbowl and HSQ for Kidderbrook. Amex does not need an eight pack. Put a carpet on South American and Tamarack and smother the base area and village with signs pointing toward them.

you do realize you can just take churchill down down to kidderbrook for shooting star trails. One runout isnt so bad after all. Plus, you are saving at least 5-6 million and getting heavier chairs on kidderbrook. I think amex could use an 8. Plus you are upgrading capacity in one area and ride time in another. for a bit less you only get the latter.

[Smacpats]

Sacdelic_Skier, on 01 June 2016 - 05:39 PM, said:

you do realize you can just take churchill down down to kidderbrook for shooting star trails. One runout isnt so bad after all. Plus, you are saving at least 5-6 million and getting heavier chairs on kidderbrook. I think amex could use an 8. Plus you are upgrading capacity in one area and ride time in another. for a bit less you only get the latter.

You've never skied Churchill downs. You don't want to do that 5 minute traverse for a 3 minute lap.

[SkiDaBird]

I'm a good skier and some of the lines on Palmyra scared the shit out of me. No need for lift access up there.

[Smacpats]

SkiDaBird, on 02 June 2016 - 12:22 AM, said:

I'm a good skier and some of the lines on Palmyra scared the shit out of me. No need for lift access up there.

I honestly am in between on this. I wonder if the terrain could handle it, whereas at the same time, look at Lone peak at Big sky. The terrain on Lone Peak is very similar.

This post has been edited by Smacpats: 02 June 2016 - 01:11 PM

[liftmech]

NHskier13, on 01 June 2016 - 11:13 AM, said:

I wonder if lifts like Rainer are having similar problems to @liftmech's flyer, that would probably dictate whether it is moved or scrapped

My baby's just getting old, it doesn't really have problems per se. I'd take Rex's terminal covers, though. Much better than mine.

[RibStaThiok]

which baby is that

[Sacdelic_Skier]

I think he is talking about the Rainer Express from Crystal